Websnark

Comment from: 32_footsteps posted at January 6, 2006 12:13 PM

And here I always associated those drinks with punk, not New Age.

Comment from: Clint H posted at January 6, 2006 12:36 PM

Yes, for Pete's sake, it NEW WAVE, not New Age... :p

Comment from: Kristofer Straub posted at January 6, 2006 12:47 PM

BELEATHERED HAND-WARMATIVE CONTRAPTIONS

Comment from: Christopher B. Wright posted at January 6, 2006 12:48 PM

Well except for Mountain Dew, I agree with the label. :)

Comment from: Lilamrta posted at January 6, 2006 12:56 PM

Winnie the Pooh!

Man, I was so mad when they changed him and the rest of the Hundred Acre Wood folk. I have both Winnie-the-Pooh and The House at Pooh Corner sitting on my bookshelf.

They ruin everything.

Comment from: Eric Burns posted at January 6, 2006 1:01 PM

Winnie the Pooh!

Man, I was so mad when they changed him and the rest of the Hundred Acre Wood folk. I have both Winnie-the-Pooh and The House at Pooh Corner sitting on my bookshelf.

They ruin everything.

Silly old bear....

Comment from: Ghastly posted at January 6, 2006 1:03 PM

Comment from: Clint H posted at January 6, 2006 12:36 PM

Yes, for Pete's sake, it NEW WAVE, not New Age... :p

Totally different head. Totally.

New Age. Jesus Christ.

Damnit! That was going to be a new character in my strip. Way to ruin it Eric!

Comment from: Eric Burns posted at January 6, 2006 1:07 PM

Ah -- but was it going to be a crystal loving Earth Tones Jesus... or Jesus Christ... TO THE EXTREME? *guitar riff*

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 6, 2006 1:15 PM

Man, I was so mad when they changed him and the rest of the Hundred Acre Wood folk.

Have you seen the latest?

Comment from: Robotech_Master posted at January 6, 2006 1:21 PM

Help me if you can, I've got to get back to the house at Pooh Corner by one...

Comment from: quiller posted at January 6, 2006 1:29 PM

OK, you know, I had thought my ex's hatred for the Disney Pooh was a little over the top. But that news story Paul linked said they were replacing Christopher Robin with a 6 year old girl (in a pastel bike helmet). Replacing Christopher Robin! I suppose next they are going to decide that Eeyore is a bit of downer and should be replaced by an energetic pony...

Well at least the Pooh Treasury I got for my 6 year old niece was the original stories and the illustrations I remember. Disney ain't getting any royalties from that.

Umm and New Age, totally scary.

Comment from: Pseudowolf posted at January 6, 2006 1:29 PM

Disney's Kanter says the new cartoon represents not an abandonment of an old, familiar world, but rather an alternate universe for Pooh and his crew.

"Alternate Universe"? ALTERNATE F'in UNIVERSE?!?

WTF???

Comment from: Alexis Christoforides posted at January 6, 2006 1:33 PM

Paul - Oh my God

Eric - New Age Jesus Christ is here, and is currently freeloading off a cat that's advertising cigarretes to Asian kids.

(Origin is left as an exercise to the reader.)

Comment from: Plaid Phantom posted at January 6, 2006 1:52 PM

@Paul's link: I think that is even worse than that whole "Loonatics" nonsense. No, I KNOW it's definitely worse. Ima gonna go curl up in a corner and cry now.

I mean, everything about this points to demographic fishing for new viewers. Sure, Disney seems to have been aiming strongly for female viewers in recent years, but you DON'T MESS WITH WINNIE THE POOH.

Comment from: admanb posted at January 6, 2006 1:52 PM

"... these timeless characters really needed a breath of fresh air"

Is it just me, or is there something fundamentally wrong with that sentence?

-Adam

Comment from: Plaid Phantom posted at January 6, 2006 1:53 PM

Oh, and "New Age": That's just hysterical.

Comment from: Ford Dent posted at January 6, 2006 1:58 PM

Oh goddammit they're going to make Pooh worse.

Not to say Pooh was bad before, but I will cop to being a fan of the original Pooh design rather than the new Disney version of him.

But tossing out Christopher Robin? What the hell are they thinking? Replace with a tomboyish Mary Sue, yeah, that's what the franchise needed. "The last thing we want to be is the ones who brought the franchise down."--Then leave Christopher Robin alone.

Comment from: dreamshade posted at January 6, 2006 2:05 PM

So does this alternate universe Pooh meet all the other alternate universe Poohs and have to convince them all to team up to stop the super Heffalump that will eventually destroy every Pooh corner and force the survivors to merge into one universe? I wonder what alternate universe Tigger is like.

Comment from: LGraf posted at January 6, 2006 2:27 PM

NOOO!

I SO dislike Di$ney...I can't even get really angry over it...too many changes "for the better" they've done just wore me down. :P I'm willing to bet also that the true reason they're putting in the girl is because the little boys play with action figures, not stuffed animals. Blah.

--L.Graf

Comment from: Christopher B. Wright posted at January 6, 2006 2:28 PM

It's Winnie the Pooh from Earth-2!

Comment from: Archon Divinus posted at January 6, 2006 2:37 PM

Crisis in Infinite Hundred Acre Woods? Crazy.

I love the real Winnie the Pooh, and while the Disney cartoon wasn't horrible, it was still never as good as the origional. And over the past couple years you could really see them messing with it too much (Like the recent movie where they meet a hephalump), but this is the worst thing thats ever been done to any series ever.

Comment from: Pseudowolf posted at January 6, 2006 2:38 PM

So does this alternate universe Pooh meet all the other alternate universe Poohs and have to convince them all to team up to stop the super Heffalump that will eventually destroy every Pooh corner and force the survivors to merge into one universe? I wonder what alternate universe Tigger is like.

Maybe this is all a lead-up to "Crisis In Infinite Hundred-Acre Woods"?

Comment from: Pseudowolf posted at January 6, 2006 2:39 PM

Dammit. Beaten to the punch by one minute.

Comment from: Wednesday White posted at January 6, 2006 2:56 PM

Eh, bitchcakes. Disney repackagings of Pooh come and go, and we forget about most of them in very short order. Consider the super-deformed, Sanrioesque reimagings (they toiled not, neither did they spin). The fursuit versions which eventually became Book of Pooh. The first smiling Eeyore merch. Eh.

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 6, 2006 2:58 PM

You know, my wife hated the Hitchhiker's Guide movie because she was in the mood for something familiar, but I loved it because I love watching a franchise, a property, a legend as it changes with the media and the times. Doctor Dolittle taught me that in 1968 (and again in 1998), and I picked King Arthur to be the protagonist of my webcomic.

Give it a chance, folks. At least watch the thing before you decide it's a disaster.

Comment from: Psylence posted at January 6, 2006 3:05 PM

From Wednesday's latest comment, it seems she, for one, may have already seen this, but Neil Gaiman had a rather interesting response to the reimaging of Pooh.

Bitchcakes indeed.

Comment from: UrsulaV posted at January 6, 2006 3:28 PM

Okay, I'm goin' to the lowest circle of hell for this, but I almost wanna see a Sanrio Pooh. Not, y'know, keep it. Just look. And perhaps poke gently with a stick.

Comment from: Christian posted at January 6, 2006 3:44 PM

Eric -- You don't happen to remember which surf song was playing in the Denny's, do you? Probably not, but as one of the few real surf enthusiasts in existence, any mention of it gets me interested.

Obligatory Pooh comment: I feel positively counter-culture now for owning "The Tao of Pooh." Thanks, Disney, for making me less mainstream!

And am I the only one who actually thinks calling sports drinks "new age" is pretty damn cool? I'd have gone in and looked around.

Comment from: Connor Moran posted at January 6, 2006 3:45 PM

Speaking of alternate versions of Winnie the Pooh,
Behold:
Vinni Pukh

From a soviet animated version of Winnie the Pooh.
Ever since seeing that image, I've really wanted to get a copy of that. Soviet animation being so briliant, I'm sure it puts the Disney stuff to shame.

Comment from: Fletch posted at January 6, 2006 4:21 PM

The sad thing? I heard "Crisis on Infinite Hundred-Acre Woods" and instantly thought of the forest from The Magician's Nephew.

And no. I haven't read any Narnia in a while (5+ years), so that's saying something...

Comment from: 32_footsteps posted at January 6, 2006 4:39 PM

You know, I can't help but wonder if there should be an equal amount of outrage for the Hundred Acre Wood levels of Kingdom Hearts. Sora replaced Christopher Robin there.

I'm personally hoping for the girl to be named either Christina, Robin, or something incorporating those two. The potential for Hundred Acre Wood intersex jokes is immeasurable.

Finally, for Jesus Christ... TO THE EXTREME!, he'd obviously be covered with tats and have a wicked goatee. But would he go with dreads, a mohawk, or shave it all off to stick it to The Man?

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 6, 2006 4:50 PM

If they're literate in the source material they'll name the girl Anne. How's that one go again? "One head brown, one head black"? That's not one of the ones I know off by heart.

Comment from: B-rent posted at January 6, 2006 5:15 PM

I'm actually more offended that you think those are "sports drinks" than I am at the "new age" label.

Then again, maybe that depends on your definition of "sport".

Comment from: DarkStar posted at January 6, 2006 6:04 PM

All the new, revisioned Winnie the Pooh is going to do is cause a lot of kids to be mightily confused. Parents, Aunts, Uncles and Grandparents will find out that their adorable younger relation has recently become very interested in "Winnie the Pooh". They, thinking that they can find a bonding point with something classic, something so intrinsic to what they new growing up, will go and purchase the loads of original Pooh stuff that is (and will remain) pervasive in the world. Especially the books.

Then the kids will receive the gifts, look at the relative askance and declaim with the total lack of tact that children have: "What the bitchcakes is this?!" (except that the interrobang will undoubtedly be used).

Mass confusion. Disney = Anarchy.

Comment from: PatMan posted at January 6, 2006 6:08 PM

Shouldn't it be "Crisis in Infinite Acre Woods"?

Y'know, like when you're playing Legend of Zelda and are too drunk to remember which direction is which.

Comment from: Alexis Christoforides posted at January 6, 2006 6:16 PM

Ditto. A horribly overpriced 0.25L caffeine jolt is not what I'd call a sport drink, except if video games are considered sports now? And people shit money?

Red Bulls are great code fuel though. And, as I have mentioned before, result in interesting behaviour when mixed with vodka and consumed.

But "New Age"? NEW AGE? I'll fucking show you New Age, come by anytime for a frappe that would kill Chuck Norris, using milk, water and Nescafe Instant.

(Yeah, Red Bull n' Vodka and cheap coffee. I'm a college student, sue me.)

Aforementioned Jesus is property of Combustible Orange. More people should read Combustible Orange.

Comment from: PatMan posted at January 6, 2006 6:28 PM

Ditto. A horribly overpriced 0.25L caffeine jolt is not what I'd call a sport drink, except if video games are considered sports now? And people shit money?

Actually, they are, despite the fact that we don't call chess, billiards, or poker sports. And the people who play games are video-athletes. (So what are massively multi-player online RPG players then? video-marathoners?)

(PS- my previous post was suposed to specifically mention the Lost Woods in Legend of Zelda.)

Comment from: PatMan posted at January 6, 2006 6:32 PM

And no, they don't shit money, but I do toss their bodies in the furnace to keep the place warm. No one ever seems to notice.

Comment from: thok posted at January 6, 2006 6:32 PM

You know, I can't help but wonder if there should be an equal amount of outrage for the Hundred Acre Wood levels of Kingdom Hearts. Sora replaced Christopher Robin there.

I think that outrage is already overwhlemed by the outrage of having boring puzzle levels in an action RPG. Plus, it's somewhat muted because Sora was clearly just passing through and one could apply that arguement to any other Disney level in the game.

The real question, of course, is how will we deal with the sequel 10 years later when Eyeore is disappointed by the lack of thistle to eat in Hundred Acre Woods and decides to restart the universe from scratch to fix that problem.

On a serious note, would people be more receptive to this idea if Christopher Robin was the new girl's father (or perhaps her creepy uncle)?

Comment from: Archon Divinus posted at January 6, 2006 6:41 PM

except if video games are considered sports now?

It's only a sport if your hitting a ball with a stick.

Comment from: PatMan posted at January 6, 2006 6:42 PM

or perhaps her creepy uncle

Only if the Hundred Acre Woods is inside of a wardrobe.

Uh-oh.

Comment from: Ojin posted at January 6, 2006 6:44 PM

I can think of one person who may be pleased by the new Pooh setting, possibly.

Last I knew, Christopher Robin (the character having been based on a real person, who when the books were written was very young) was getting a litle fed up with his main claim to fame being the connection with the fictional character. ;p

Of course, I may totally be misremembering this...

Comment from: Nich posted at January 6, 2006 6:51 PM

"I'm personally hoping for the girl to be named either Christina, Robin, or something incorporating those two."

I think she should be called Robin Christopher.

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 6, 2006 6:54 PM

Christopher Milne died in 1995 or 1996.

He wrote a book called Enchanted Places about being the boy immortalized in an ubiquitously loved children's book. The last chapter has a short preface which reads in essence, "If you like happy endings to your fairy tales, put this book down now."

Alan Milne always thought of himself as a playwright. You will, too, if you read his plays, even though you'll still remember him for this other thing like we all do. If I draw my webcomic for twenty-five years and am remembered more for pithy comments in someone else's blog I'll be pissed too.

Comment from: 32_footsteps posted at January 6, 2006 7:49 PM

"And the people who play games are video-athletes."

Argh... as someone whose lifelong dream was to make money off of playing video games, I can't stand it when people try to claim the word "athlete" belongs to a professional game player. If you want a short, pithy title, call them "pro gamers." It's plenty descriptive and doesn't create the illusion that they're somehow athletic.

Well, okay, people who enter contests for games like DDR and PIU could conceivably be called athletes. But none of them care for the title, either.

Comment from: PatMan posted at January 6, 2006 8:42 PM

You mean most of them don't really call themselves athletes? Oh thank god. Cause, you know, it ain't atheletic.

(neither is golf. :P)

Comment from: Tyck posted at January 6, 2006 8:50 PM

"... these timeless characters really needed a breath of fresh air"

Is it just me, or is there something fundamentally wrong with that sentence?

It's not just you. The people who write marketing bylines have a chronic case of Not Getting It. Either that or these releases are finally being written entirely by automation, and nobody is bothering to check them before press.

So does this alternate universe Pooh meet all the other alternate universe Poohs and have to convince them all to team up to stop the super Heffalump that will eventually destroy every Pooh corner and force the survivors to merge into one universe? I wonder what alternate universe Tigger is like.

..because, you know, I'd watch it. I'd be a little ashamed of it, but I'd watch it.

Comment from: Tyck posted at January 6, 2006 8:52 PM

..apparently I have an unclosed tag somewhere in that last post. Maybe I should start using preview.

Also, New Age? Does that even mean anything? Seriously, can anybody tell me what New Age *means*? Bueller?

Comment from: GregC posted at January 6, 2006 9:54 PM

"... these timeless characters really needed a breath of fresh air"

Found: the ultimate backhanded compliment.

That quote means the person finds Pooh old and stale. Why couldn't they just say they were making a new story "loosely based" on the old one? It would give them an excuse for creative license without dissing the original. Someone was just being a jerk. Probably pissed because they still had to pay royalties as a derivitive work after making those changes.

Comment from: Paul A. posted at January 6, 2006 11:04 PM

On a serious note, would people be more receptive to this idea if Christopher Robin was the new girl's father (or perhaps her creepy uncle)?

Me, I'd be less receptive. I don't mind an alternate universe, because then I can just say "Ah, that doesn't count" and ignore it; but including Adult Christopher Robin would make it look like this is meant to be the true future of Pooh, which would make me Unhappy.

Comment from: miyaa posted at January 6, 2006 11:16 PM

1) Disney knows that anything original it does for movie making usually fails. Last evidence: Sky High (Kurt Russel playing a father? Did I just suddenly get a gray hair?)

2) Sanrio Pooh? Dear god, I just have visions of Christopher Robin transforming into some super sailor Bridget to save a Doremon-like Pooh from the evil Sanrio Sailor Moon.

3) Who hasn't gotten drunk while playing Zelda? (That and playing fighting games while drunk is a hoot. Drunk and playing DDR...not so much.)

4) New Age means basically any kind of counterculture ideal that stems from the late 1960's and early 1970's. Typically used to describe such religious cults such as Wicca, Druidism, Tarot Cards, etc. (Even through a lot of this kind of stuff has been around for centuries, even predating Christanity. It's just that it wasn't taken seriously until the 1960's.) Typically viewed as being very left centered politics/or radical to revolutionary.

Comment from: Alexis Christoforides posted at January 6, 2006 11:36 PM

miyaa - Try playing Super Mario Bros 3 while drunk with a few friends, It's fun!

Also re: New Age; I don't know if that's the meaning they are implying. I, for one, have seen energy drinks being labelled as "new age drinks" before, and a google search shows that it's a pretty standard term for drinks that seem to focus on, well, something other than taste, mostly.

Comment from: Archon Divinus posted at January 7, 2006 12:22 AM

Disney knows that anything original it does for movie making usually fails. Last evidence: Sky High

Except that Sky High was a complete rip-off of PS238.

Comment from: MarvinAndroid posted at January 7, 2006 1:14 AM

I don't see the point of Red Bull. It tastes like cough syrup that's been left in the sun for three weeks and then carbonated. If you're going to mix it with vodka anyway, why not just drink the bottle of cough syrup?

And did Mountain Dew NEED an energy drink? Last I checked, it's a bottle of pure caffiene stained a frightening yellow-green color. That is not a natural color. That's the color of the stuff Shredder used to become Super-Shredder in the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles movie.

And am I the only one who thinks "New Age" sounds remarkably like "New Coke" when used in the context of drinks? Maybe that's the secret: Red Bull is actually twenty-year-old "New Coke" left over from the eighties.

-MarvinAndroid

Comment from: miyaa posted at January 7, 2006 1:32 AM

I think even Jolt has an energy drink. That's gotta be radioactive.

Comment from: Tyck posted at January 7, 2006 1:40 AM

New Age means basically any kind of counterculture ideal that stems from the late 1960's and early 1970's. Typically used to describe such religious cults such as Wicca, Druidism, Tarot Cards, etc. (Even through a lot of this kind of stuff has been around for centuries, even predating Christanity. It's just that it wasn't taken seriously until the 1960's.) Typically viewed as being very left centered politics/or radical to revolutionary.

Ho..kay..definition above. Mountain Dew, the official drink of the X-treme College Slacker. Marketers, I do not think these words mean what you think they mean.

Comment from: RoboYuji posted at January 7, 2006 1:59 AM

Mountain Dew is yummy! I'm not sure about "New Age" but it is yummy.

Comment from: Arra posted at January 7, 2006 2:31 AM

Re: Pooh: I'm personally more disturbed by the cheap computer animation. At least when they animated him at first, it was PRETTY. (Though, I admit, that's a pretty bad shot in the article, and for all I know it's actually lovely animation. But given current Disney channel standards . . . I doubt it.)

I mean, slapping cheap computer animation on the Care Bears was one thing, but this is POOH.

Comment from: gwalla posted at January 7, 2006 4:52 AM

Jolt makes a canned espresso. Cola-flavored espresso.

Comment from: gwalla posted at January 7, 2006 5:00 AM

BTW, the best thing about Denny's is that they'll make a chocolate Coke. They'll look at you funny but they'll do it. I used to hang out at the Denny's across from campus in the middle of the night with my buddies in college, drinking chocolate Cokes, stuffing myself with mozzarella sticks and onion rings, and feeling my arteries hardening. Good times, good times...

Comment from: Abby L. posted at January 7, 2006 7:13 AM

The Pooh news underwhelms me. I have honestly stopped caring what Disney does to mess up their properties. It doesn't destroy the books.

Comment from: Adrean posted at January 7, 2006 7:42 AM

Thanks all. The theme song from the original Disney movie's stuck in my head now...

o/' Winnie the Pooh... Winnie the Pooh... Winnie the Pooh Bear! o/'

Comment from: 32_footsteps posted at January 7, 2006 10:22 AM

I'd just like to pipe up and say that I've never had alcohol at all. Not stopping anyone else, but none for me, thanks. So for someone with a 40 hour per week video gaming habit/would-be profession, I've never played any game drunk.

As for that Pooh animation, I'm fairly certain that was from a game - It would be really low-class computer animation if that was to stand alone, but it would be fairly solid graphics on any of the current-gen consoles.

As for energy drinks... I think it's so you can pump yourself full of chemicals other than caffeine and sugar that will keep you awake. Of course, still don't know if they're good for you or not.

Finally, my favorite part of Sky High was the soundtrack, where they just did covers of older cool songs from the late 70's and 80's. I had one friend insistthat They Might Be Giants got away with the one original song - until I proved to him that "Through Being Cool" was originally done by DEVO. Though TMBG covering DEVO might be one of the biggest geeky songs I've ever heard.

Comment from: Violet posted at January 7, 2006 12:42 PM

Gracious me. Disney's Pooh has been revisionist from the start. Never mind the fursuits; what of Gopher?

("I'm a little man. I'm a little man. He's a great man." - Piglet)

Comment from: Freemage posted at January 7, 2006 7:49 PM

On Denny's:

Sadly, the local Denny's restaurants have been a major disappointment since we moved here a year ago. One isn't even open 24 hours. One has such lousy service we actually walked out after waiting 20 minutes for someone to come and get our drink order. And the third has instituted a "dining only" policy, at least during the night shift. Meaning, for instance, you can't pull out a deck of cards while waiting for your deep-fried food order.

At least we managed to find a 24/7 IHOP.

On the new Pooh:

*Comment drowned out by the sound of a man's spleen being coughed out his nose.* Eh, that's about right.

And yes, "timeless characters need a breath of fresh air" was so, so painful it made me want to pay for this woman's involuntary sterilization. We must protect the gene pool somehow....

Comment from: larksilver posted at January 7, 2006 9:25 PM

Meaning, for instance, you can't pull out a deck of cards while waiting for your deep-fried food order.

There is something frighteningly wrong with this. I can't tell you how many nights I spent studying with my friends after work at Denny's.

Comment from: 32_footsteps posted at January 7, 2006 10:46 PM

I could really use a Denny's. for reasons I can't begin to fathom, they have no penetrated the Boston metro area. Probably because the idea of something being open past 11 PM is unheard of in eastern Massachusetts. Instead, we're stuck with Bickford's. For those not familiar with the franchise, it's like Denny's, except it makes Denny's cooking look like ambrosia. I have one within about a ten minute walk from my house, and I refuse to eat there.

I could really use a nearby IHOP. Call me crazy (which you probably already do), but I love their pancakes. I could eat them all day, if given the chance.

Comment from: Robert Hutchinson posted at January 7, 2006 11:00 PM

I have eaten at a Denny's exactly once, and the food and service was so horrible that I've never been tempted to go back. And I eat at McDonald's often, so.

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 7, 2006 11:58 PM

And yes, "timeless characters need a breath of fresh air" was so, so painful

"Someone's written down The Iliad! So you have to read it instead of listen to it! Well, I won't stand for it."

"Chretien de Troyes has a new romance out, about a Round Table knight named Lancelot who has an affair with Queen Guenevere! Who do these French writers think they are?"

"Hey, have you seen the new play at the Globe, what's it called, Romeo & Juliet?" "Yeah, it's just Pyramus & Thisbe with a family feud tacked on to make it last ninety minutes. I wish that hack'd stop screwing with Ovid."

"In the second season they're bringing in Patrick McNee to play the new lead, a secret agent. Why even keep it on, that's what I want to know."

Comment from: Merus posted at January 8, 2006 4:22 AM

But, Paul, they're leaving all the other characters the same. Re-invention is a staple of creative endeavour, after all, but the question is whether this is good for the story or purely driven by demographics.

Comment from: Sundre posted at January 8, 2006 9:33 AM

Adrean: Fun fact: if you get someone else to cooperate, you can sing the Winnie the Pooh theme (all stuffed with fluff, oh) and Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer simultaneously. And it kinda works.

At least, the first part does. I never kept from laughing long enough to get to the end.

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 8, 2006 10:13 AM

the question is whether this is good for the story or purely driven by demographics

It can be both. But we won't know till we see it.

Comment from: baf posted at January 8, 2006 12:37 PM

OK, I'm going to take an unpopular stand here and say that Eric's behavior at the convenience store is abhorrent, and Wednesday's is worse. What we have here is a clear case of bonding via the denigration of others.

I could be wrong about this. It's possibly that if Eric had gone into that store without Wednesday, and noticed the ridiculous signage on his own, he would have still decided to boycott the place. But it seems more likely that he would have still bought what he needed, possibly making a note to snark about the sign later. That's the way people generally behave when they're not trying to impress upon someone else the strength of their mutual tastes.

This is a fast and powerful way to reinforce a social bond, but it's somewhat evil. It's kind of like using the dark side of the Force that way. It's not cute, it's not clever, and it's certainly not praiseworthy; its essentially the same thing that high-school cliques do when they make fun of the unpopular kids.

Comment from: Brendan posted at January 8, 2006 12:43 PM

Concord? As in "it was two by the village clock when he came to the bridge in Concord-town?" I thought it was illegal to sell beer at that kind of store around here...

Comment from: Eric Burns posted at January 8, 2006 1:14 PM

I could be wrong about this. It's possibly that if Eric had gone into that store without Wednesday, and noticed the ridiculous signage on his own, he would have still decided to boycott the place.

Unquestionably.

It's not cute, it's not clever, and it's certainly not praiseworthy; its essentially the same thing that high-school cliques do when they make fun of the unpopular kids.

All of which would be perfectly true if convenience stores had emotions.

I'm not denying that the world is a wondrous place -- alive, with faces in every rock and moments of joy to be eked out of all surroundings. However, I am denying that a convenience store married to a gas station with a Dunkin Donuts drive through nailed on with a nailgun has the presence of mind to be offended when I notice something patently absurd and decide "wow. These people don't get to have my money."

Said ridiculous signage, for the record, goes hand in hand with the decision to have a 24 hour convenience store -- one that is next to a second 24 hour convenience store, no less -- that doesn't have coffee after 11 pm. I mean, do you understand how stupid that is? Who do you think goes into convenience stores at one in the morning anyhow.

There was no clerk near to hand (in fact, said clerk stayed back in the back office the entire time we were in the store. Nor would I have stood and pointed and laughed at said clerk and blamed them for decisions they had no part in. There was just Wednesday and I, and a store that threw "New Age" above Sobe, Red Bull, Gatorade and Mountain Dew. (Extreme I could have understood, though I would have eyerolled) and failed to have coffee. At that moment -- that exquisite, surreal moment -- I knew I wasn't going to hand my money to that particular corporation.

I do not eschew the right of commentary on the ridiculous and banal. Nor do I begin to feel guilty about it. There is a point where sensitivity does absolutely nothing except make the entire cause of sensitivity look ridiculous. I submit that taking me to task for responding to corporate absurdity -- and getting a pack of laughs out of it -- and comparing it to the degradation of actual human beings by social classes does nothing except damage the cause to raise sensitivity over those actual struggles.

Put way more simply... it's a heck of a lot worse to compare the problems of pariahs and social outcasts to a snotty comment made about a sign than it is to make a snotty comment about a sign.

Comment from: UrsulaV posted at January 8, 2006 2:01 PM

Dude, if our society has become so unbelieveably humorless that someone can't laugh at a weird sign without being accused of weird, cliquish and abhorrent behavior...Great gibbering monkeybats. Are we just on the prowl for Stuff To Be Offended By or what?

Comment from: baf posted at January 8, 2006 3:01 PM

It's not about making the convenience store feel bad. I'm all in favor of hurting people's feelings, if there's a good reason for it. No, it's about gloves. You needed gloves, you had the opportunity to buy gloves, you left without gloves. Why?

OK, so you were already annoyed by the store's lack of coffee, and the sign was the last straw. I failed to take that into account, and I apologize. You may also have stronger feelings about the words "new age" than I realize -- I imagine I'd leave if the sign said "racial purity" or something.

I think it's Wednesday's "No, you're not" that got to me. To these eyes, that looked demanding -- like there was a subtext of "if you had gone ahead and bought gloves anyway, there would have been trouble." And that made it look like you were making a sacrifice (albeit a small one) in order to make a mandatory demonstration of a mandatory opinion. That's a bad road to even start down, especially for an essayist.

But on reflection, if there's one person who should be above suspicion of subordinating his opinions to anything, it's you.

Comment from: Eric Burns posted at January 8, 2006 3:11 PM

I think it's Wednesday's "No, you're not" that got to me. To these eyes, that looked demanding -- like there was a subtext of "if you had gone ahead and bought gloves anyway, there would have been trouble."

Well, no.

That was Wednesday understanding me. And understanding, innately, that this was the kind of thing that would make me decide to leave without buying gloves.

It's not that she would have thought less of me had I bought the gloves.

It's that she knows me.

Dude, that's a rare and wonderful thing.

Comment from: Canuck-Errant posted at January 8, 2006 3:24 PM

The only Mountain Dews with caffiene (or guarana) in them in Canada are the new ones.

Comment from: Plaid Phantom posted at January 8, 2006 6:13 PM

Wait, if there's not caffiene in regular Mountain Dew, then what's left? Carbonated water? That stuff tastes pretty bad, as those who have found themselves in front of a fountain that's run out of syrup would know.

Comment from: Tice with a J posted at January 8, 2006 6:36 PM

Hooray for Russian Pooh!

Comment from: DocN posted at January 8, 2006 7:22 PM

Can someone explain, in words of two or fewer syllables, what was so bad about "New Age"?

The term, to me, conjures up the eighties versions of hippies, the belief in the "power" of "crystals" and badly misapplied uses of the terms "karma" and "aura".

Putting that over a coolerful of sports and energy drinks would indeed strike me as wrong, but more of a "Isn't that kind of stupid?" sort of wrong, rather than some subtle form of evil intent, or the expression of an unsavory mindset.

I mean, other than the whole idea of astrology. I mean, dude, Jupiter doesn't give a rat's ass when you were born, okay?

Doc.

Comment from: Freemage posted at January 8, 2006 8:06 PM

[quote]"Someone's written down The Iliad! So you have to read it instead of listen to it! Well, I won't stand for it."

"Chretien de Troyes has a new romance out, about a Round Table knight named Lancelot who has an affair with Queen Guenevere! Who do these French writers think they are?"

"Hey, have you seen the new play at the Globe, what's it called, Romeo & Juliet?" "Yeah, it's just Pyramus & Thisbe with a family feud tacked on to make it last ninety minutes. I wish that hack'd stop screwing with Ovid."

"In the second season they're bringing in Patrick McNee to play the new lead, a secret agent. Why even keep it on, that's what I want to know."[/quote]

Paul: See, here's the thing. A 'timeless character' wouldn't need a breath of fresh air. They've already achieved immortality. It's not necessarily the change that's bad (hey, I adore Gossamer Commons--how tightly bound to 'original source material' can I be?). It's the assault on the English language, combined with the backhanded compliment that really was tantamount to calling the original Pooh 'stale' that irritated me.

Sure, if the new character really adds something other than a different demographic spin to the setting, fine. Now, my own feelings about Disney are more pessimistic than that, but hey, they've surprised me before (for instance, I was rather pleased with the Narnia movie).

Comment from: Wednesday White posted at January 8, 2006 9:01 PM

Putting that over a coolerful of sports and energy drinks would indeed strike me as wrong, but more of a "Isn't that kind of stupid?" sort of wrong, rather than some subtle form of evil intent, or the expression of an unsavory mindset.

Well, yeah. It's bloody stupid. It was so stupid that we had to go away. "This is idiotic. We can't give them money right now. It overwhelms us."

(Really, what would have been wrong with "Energy Drinks"?)

I assure you all, I have not engaged the flagellatory vulva.

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 8, 2006 10:01 PM

A 'timeless character' wouldn't need a breath of fresh air. They've already achieved immortality.

No one said need. Doesn't mean it can't be used.

It's not necessarily the change that's bad (hey, I adore Gossamer Commons--how tightly bound to 'original source material' can I be?). It's the assault on the English language, combined with the backhanded compliment that really was tantamount to calling the original Pooh 'stale' that irritated me.

I get you, but I despise the prejudgment of screen projects at the announcement stage.

Comment from: EsotericWombat posted at January 8, 2006 10:36 PM

"despise the prejudgment of screen projects at the announcement stage."

Really? Because if I heard that, for the sake of arguement, Vin Diesel was going to play the part of Spider-Man, I wouldn't hesitate to prejudge.

Comment from: Prodigal posted at January 8, 2006 11:04 PM

It struck me as stupid, as well. So, on top of the stupidity of not having coffee after 11pm, they're labeling drinks "New Age"? I'm not shopping there, either.

Comment from: miyaa posted at January 9, 2006 12:46 AM

DocN: Jupiter might not care, but Uranus would. (Sorry, pun had to be said. Forgive me!) As for what was wrong with New Age? In two words: Radical views.

Yeah, I would agree it is stupid to label sports drinks as "New Age" (I think the term that should have been used, if you were to label a class of drinks is "Generation X"), but stupid enough to decide never to shop there again until they changed the labeling? Ehh. I'd would have such rude service at the place or something that so severely disagreed with my ethical or moral beliefs for me to decide to never shop at that place again.

As another thought, aren't all fictional characters timeless? It's not like you're going to read the book again, and find them doing something else completely different. Even if it was one of those Choose Your Own Adventure books. Whatever happened to that series?

Comment from: UrsulaV posted at January 9, 2006 12:48 AM

I am ashamed to admit that I would go see a Vin Diesel Spiderman movie.

Okay, I'd go see two hours of Vin Diesel reading the phone book in front of a brick wall.

There may be something wrong with me.

Comment from: 32_footsteps posted at January 9, 2006 11:47 AM

If it makes you feel better, Ursula, I'm endlessly fascinated by the acting oeuvre of Bruce Willis. I'm always entertained by him. Always. I'm sure this is a crime against taste, and I'm unapologetic about it.

Comment from: larksilver posted at January 9, 2006 2:58 PM

Ursula: I too find myself oddly fascinated by Mr. Diesel's unique qualities. It's not that I even find him attractive, per se... he's just so interesting.

He may be ruined forever as a tough guy in my mind, however. Every time I see him, or see his name mentioned, now, I see him doing the Peter Panda Dance from that Disney movie. Too fun.

Comment from: PlaidRab posted at January 9, 2006 5:54 PM

Ursula: My wife has similar reactions. She has this odd dream about Vin, the Rock, and Oded Fehr (Sp?) in a homoerotic buddy action flick.

As long as enough stuff goes kaboom, I'm in.

Comment from: jason posted at January 9, 2006 9:36 PM

Ursula, I'ld suggest seeking professional help.

Now if it were Chuck Norris, that would be completly understandable...

Comment from: Plaid Phantom posted at January 10, 2006 1:00 AM

miyaa: I've actually been thinking about CYOA books recently. More specifically, whether I would have the capability of making them myself. In an online format. And making money doing it. (Books would be simple!)

Along those lines, has anyone ever thought of a choose-your-own-adventure webcomic?

Comment from: Plaid Phantom posted at January 10, 2006 1:01 AM

Now if it were Chuck Norris, that would be completly understandable...

Angels sang out, in an immaculate chorus. Down from the heavens descended Chuck Norris...

Comment from: Prodigal posted at January 10, 2006 1:27 AM

Chuck Norris does not use a nightlight because he is afraid of the dark. The dark is afraid of Chuck Norris.

Comment from: Aerin posted at January 10, 2006 1:29 AM

I wrote a CYOA book way back in elementary school, for my gifted class. I think doing one online would be even easier than doing a book, because I seem to recall that the most time-consuming part of making the book was deciding on the order of the pages, since they have to be appropriately wonky. An online version wouldn't have to say, "Go to page 41," it would just say, "Click here," which would be so very much easier.

Along those lines, has anyone ever thought of a choose-your-own-adventure webcomic?

Well, we have now...

Comment from: EsotericWombat posted at January 10, 2006 1:52 AM

*pulls the Walker Texas Ranger Lever*

Comment from: Ray Radlein posted at January 10, 2006 3:07 AM

Along those lines, has anyone ever thought of a choose-your-own-adventure webcomic?

Scott McCloud, of course.

Comment from: KennyCelican posted at January 10, 2006 11:25 AM

On dissing release announcements -

Sometimes they just sound absurd, and sometimes they change the existing material SO MUCH that the series becomes an entirely different series.

Actually, Avengers second season and beyond really isn't anything like Avengers season one, and there wasn't really a following for season one. Note, I may be off by a season there - there may have been two seasons before McNee, although iirc he was introduced a season before he became the main character.

That's a good example of a series that changed SO much that it really wasn't the same series, yet the change was entirely for the better.

And, to make the digression complete, Emma Peel. Mmmmmm. What was I saying again?

Oh, right - Dennys will also make Cherry Butterscotch Chocolate Coke. Actually, they'll put any of the ice cream syrup toppings into the Coke if you ask them to.

Comment from: Eric Burns posted at January 10, 2006 11:50 AM

Oh, right - Dennys will also make Cherry Butterscotch Chocolate Coke. Actually, they'll put any of the ice cream syrup toppings into the Coke if you ask them to.

I lost four years of lifespan just reading that.

Comment from: Merus posted at January 10, 2006 11:57 AM

It's a poor year indeed that does not spawn someone reimagining Alice in Wonderland.

This has been your Moment of Zen.

Comment from: KennyCelican posted at January 10, 2006 12:51 PM

"It's a poor year indeed that does not spawn someone reimagining Alice in Wonderland."

I can't pass up AiW references, they will forever bring up a fond memory for me.

My last 'first date' was with a coworker. The first time I saw her wearing 'non-work' clothing was that date. Her shirt had a cheshire cat on it, and, in large letters, "I'm mad, you're mad, we're all mad here".

Did I mention my wife's name is Alice?

Comment from: Eric Burns posted at January 10, 2006 12:55 PM

I'm currently acting in a school production of Alice in Wonderland. A musical, adapted from the source wholly on site.

There is a rumor it will involve me wearing a dress.

Comment from: Freemage posted at January 10, 2006 2:12 PM

Damonk also did a choose-your-own-adventure episode of Framed!, at least once or twice, during his Sin City riff.

Damn, I miss that strip.

Paul: Hm... Maybe. Like I said, I'm forced to admit that Disney has surprised me before. We can always form the lynch mob AFTER the new character premieres.

Comment from: 32_footsteps posted at January 10, 2006 2:15 PM

But what kind of dress? Is it a nice dress you'd wear to church on Sunday? Is it a matronly frock? Or is it a slinky black number that...

(Looks over at Wednesday)

... would get me killed if I discussed it any further?

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 10, 2006 2:50 PM

There is a rumor it will involve me wearing a dress.

If they're not asking you to shave, then they've got better makeup than my school did.

Comment from: larksilver posted at January 10, 2006 3:00 PM

While the original Pooh stuff is better (of course), I'm just a little black raincloud, hovering under the honey tree.

This song is completely engrained in my psyche. It was my nephew's choice of lullaby, and my son now sings it. Whatever else, Disney did a terrific job capturing the spirit of Pooh, originally. When they were still having the characters step out of the storybook, even down to turning the "page" when Tigger and Roo were stuck in the tree, they "got" the feeling, even if the characters didn't look just like the story.

It's been in recent years when they keep trying to recapture the magic and failing that it's been... well, not so good. Which is sad, because I'm a total Pooh fan. I just pretend the newer stuff isn't out there, and it all works out. I imagine I'll do the same with this.. this.. girl.

Comment from: quiller posted at January 10, 2006 3:29 PM

Well Eric would only really need to shave if he was wearing the dress because he had a female part or was playing a female impersonator. No need if he's just being a guy in a dress.

And a full beard just adds a little absurdity to things anyways. In a cut-down Midsummer's production I played Flute for a short time (who is the one cast as Thisbe), I think I even got to say the line "But, I've got a beard coming in" all while I had a full beard of dark brown hair. (Umm, the short time refers to the fact that I was primarily Demetrius and we only had one scene with the players still in the play so I was doublecast, not a short time cause I got kicked out of the role.)

Comment from: Ray Radlein posted at January 10, 2006 3:48 PM

Like I said, I'm forced to admit that Disney has surprised me before.

Why, yes. Yes they have.

(All I can add to that is a hearty, "God bless the internets, without which I never would have had my gob smacked by the sight of this video")

Comment from: Aerin posted at January 10, 2006 4:32 PM

It's not just Pooh. In the '90s, Disney "got" storytelling in general, and now they don't, and they think they're getting their asses routinely and soundly kicked by Pixar and the Shrek films just because of the graphics. I think Iger might be slightly more capable than recent Eisner (after all, Eisner ushered in the Silver Age of Disney animation before he went batshit insane), but I'm waiting for Rapunzel before I fully form that opinion.

Oh, and Ray: I have to dispute one of the points of the Rotten Tomatoes article. Disney may not publicly make a big deal of "The Story of Menstruation," but the first time I heard about that short was at Disney Traditions, the orientation class you take before you start working at Disneyland. So they definitely do acknowledge that particular period (so to speak) in their history.

Comment from: 32_footsteps posted at January 10, 2006 6:49 PM

I have to share a brief conversation I just had.

Me: Look, here's info on that Disney menstruation cartoon.

Wife: Wait, "while completely avoiding the subject of sex"? How does that work? "Why are you menstruating?" "Just because."

Comment from: Plaid Phantom posted at January 10, 2006 8:02 PM

... would get me killed if I discussed it any further?

Yes. In revenge. My poor, poor, mind deserves no less after that terrifying thought.

Comment from: Paul A. posted at January 11, 2006 4:59 AM

"In the second season they're bringing in Patrick McNee to play the new lead, a secret agent. Why even keep it on, that's what I want to know."

Actually, Avengers second season and beyond really isn't anything like Avengers season one, and there wasn't really a following for season one. Note, I may be off by a season there - there may have been two seasons before McNee, although iirc he was introduced a season before he became the main character.

Let's get this straight: While Patrick Macnee (note spelling, by the way) did not become the series lead until season two, he was in The Avengers right from the very first episode.

(Also, apart from some early indications, the real stylistic break-point was the beginning of season four. Not by mere coincidence, this was also the point at which the show started depending on American co-production.)

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 11, 2006 6:39 AM

Perhaps Battlestar Galactica would have been a better example for my purposes.

Comment from: KennyCelican posted at January 11, 2006 1:22 PM

Paul A -

I bow to your obviously superior 'The Avengers' knowledge. Mine mostly comes from my wife's infatuation with the show. Since she doesn't consider anything without Cathy Gale or Emma Peel to be worthy of her time, my knowledge of anything other than those seasons mostly comes from research done while trying to find obscure birthday or christmas gifts for her.

That being said, while the style went from 'gritty' to 'campy' sometime in late season three / early season four, the actual premise of the show in season one, from which it derives it's name was iirc a man avenging the murder of his wife. Unless I'm missing something, which is quite possible, season two and beyond never actually acknowledge the existance of said man at all, but do acknowledge each other. Catherine Gale goes on an extended vacation, which explains her absence, John Steed looks in his little black book, which incidentally I'd have sold internal organs to have had as a teen, to find a new adventuring companion, and later in the series Steed notes to Mrs. Peel that he's received a letter from Mrs. Gale, who is enjoying her vacation (as a Bond Girl, which is also referenced).

My point here is that while the style changed, it was still recognizable as the same series. The story changed completely at the end of episode one.

Paul G -

How would Battlestar Galactica be better for your porpoises?

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 11, 2006 2:21 PM

Battlestar Galactica might have better served the point I was making because (a) I'm more familiar with it and unlikely to make the sort of blatant errors that were in what I said or didn't say about The Avengers (b) BSG's is a case of an actual new, "alternate universe" version of a pop myth (c) The new alternate universe of BSG is radically different and inarguably an audience success (d) gender-bending of a, or the, lead character is involved.

First person to ask me why Heffalumps attack every thirty-three minutes owes me a biscuit.

Comment from: Robert Hutchinson posted at January 11, 2006 6:40 PM

Paul: The most wonderful thing about Tiggers, is that--oh, wait.

Comment from: KennyCelican posted at January 11, 2006 8:13 PM

Ah. Thanks much. And it does indeed make your point, that with good craftsmanship changes can be made, even significant ones, without ruining the material.

Comment from: miyaa posted at January 11, 2006 11:58 PM

I wonder whom might have appeared in that menstruation cartoon from Disney? Tinkerbell? Daisy Duck? Alice? Mary Poppins?

Paul, I'm still trying to figure out what Lorne Green was doing playing the head honcho on the original series, and I wasn't even born when Battlestar Galactica was originally on. (I blame my Jamaican roommate for knowing this.)

Comment from: Aerin posted at January 12, 2006 12:56 AM

Oh man, I can envision Mary Poppins teaching about menstruation. It's wonderful in a terrible and twisted way. Especially if she's teaching Alice... I think it's the accent.

Comment from: Prodigal posted at January 12, 2006 2:19 AM

I don't want to know what the spoonful of sugar would be for.

Comment from: Paul Gadzikowski posted at January 12, 2006 11:15 AM

I'm still trying to figure out what Lorne Green was doing playing the head honcho on the original series

The original BSG, being a STAR WARS bandwagon effort, had a much lighter mood than the modern series. Imagine Jean-Luc Picard as the fleet commander and Hawkeye Pierce as the premier fighter pilot.

Comment from: 32_footsteps posted at January 12, 2006 11:45 AM

"I don't want to know what the spoonful of sugar would be for."

Oh, you still just eat it. The difference is, it's been changed from "a spoonful of sugar" to "a pint of Ben & Jerry's."

Comment from: Tropylium posted at January 12, 2006 3:51 PM

Hey, it just occured to me that maybe the label wasn't supposed to read "NEW AGE" but rather "NEWAGE". As in "new sewage". :B

Comment from: Paul A. posted at January 13, 2006 2:13 AM

the actual premise of the show in season one, from which it derives it's name was iirc a man avenging the murder of his wife.

That lasted all of two episodes. Episode one: Dr Keel's fiancee is murdered, Keel sets out to find murderers, mysterious Mr Steed offers assistance. Episode two: Keel and Steed nobble murderers, Steed offers formal partnership, series enters era of Steed-and-X-solve-strange-crimes. (But they kept the title, because it sounded good.)

In season two, they opened things up a bit, to show that Steed actually has a variety of assistants, none of whom knew about the others; Keel would have been one of them if the actor hadn't left the series. None of the new regulars were much chop, apart from Cathy Gale, so halfway through season two they went back to only showing one assistant at a time.

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