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Eric: There are days....

...when you just don't even feel like reading webcomics. Or much of anything else on the web.

With luck, that'll change, but for right now I'm just keeping the browser off and reading the cheerful mail.

So very cheerful, that mail.

Later, all.

Posted by Eric Burns-White at March 15, 2005 10:59 AM

Comments

Comment from: Greg Dean posted at March 15, 2005 11:17 AM

Cheer up, bro. We'll be waiting for ya when you get back.

Comment from: Haver posted at March 15, 2005 11:19 AM

I don't know if I'm talking a load of old tosh here, but if this is related to some of the press you've been getting. Don't sweat it. These guys only come down on people when they're not on top form. That's how they entertain. Everyone makes mistakes, it's healthy to make mistakes. You're a strong, valiant man. You're a good person and you've brought so much to many, many people. Uncle Ben's words are probably appropriate -- "With great power comes great responsibility". Spiderman slipped up, and look at him now.

You're on the way up. For them, it's only a case of going down.

I'll miss your snarking this evening.

Comment from: Dave Van Domelen posted at March 15, 2005 11:57 AM

You can catch up on my superhero fiction while you wait for the ****storm to subside, Eric. :)

(http://www.eyrie.org/~dvandom/ASH Heh)

Comment from: Reave posted at March 15, 2005 12:42 PM

Not to sound like a dick or anything, but when you stick your foot in the dog's cage, you really can't complain when you get bitten. Don't get me wrong - kudos to you for speaking your mind, but what did you expect? Bobby Crosby posted on the issue. Bobby "holy crap, I'm crazy" Crosby. It's like taking a torch to a gasoline fume convention.

Still, would rather you focus on what you do best and overanalyze the webcomicry of the world for the amusement and enjoyment of others. Less foot biting that route, I hear.

Comment from: alschroeder posted at March 15, 2005 1:53 PM

You think creators need a thick hide? Just sometimes, critics need a thicker one. It's never easy. And nobody's perfect.

We'll look for your return. Missya.---Al

Comment from: miyaa posted at March 15, 2005 1:55 PM

You know, when I get into such a funk, I'll turn to softer comics like Peanuts, Count Your Sheep, or my personal favorite, Bunny. Humor goes a long way while suffering during a funk.

Comment from: Tangent posted at March 15, 2005 2:16 PM

You're not missing much, Eric. Just Bobby flaming everything in sight, Kurtz validating half of Bobby's claims against Kurtz by being a dick on the internet and then flaming all of Keenspot when people start telling Kurtz he was wrong to egg Bobby on, and then the Godwin Principle being invoked to try and kill the thread.

All in all, today is a day to go out, pick up the Incredibles, and just work through all of it, laughing and enjoying oneself. Hmm, think I'll do just that. After I go job hunting. :D

Robert A. Howard

Comment from: Shay Caron posted at March 15, 2005 2:33 PM

In case you haven't seen:

http://www.livejournal.com/users/ursulav/301903.html

Comment from: quiller posted at March 15, 2005 2:39 PM

Kind of funny that the day Felicity has a reference to getting snarked right in the comic would be the day Eric decides to not look at anything on the web.

But yeah, good to take a break from things every once in a while, even if you do have to spend time catching up when you get back. Not that much gets updated on Tuesdays anyways, good day to take a break.

Comment from: Shadowydreamer posted at March 15, 2005 3:07 PM

Sit back in your favourite chair, hug your cat (she should just love that ^_^), watch something silly and remember the sources. I've often noticed with Kurtz, for all that I like his comic, if he is not the centre of attention will fling feces until he is. Maybe that's why Bobby Crosby and he get along *so* well..

Comment from: Xeres posted at March 15, 2005 3:36 PM

*obligatory post of support goes here*

Regardless of what errors were made in that post, I still enjoy the sentiment. Hell, you're more than many who simply go back and erase or 'lose' their mistakes.

More power to you. Rock rock on.

Comment from: Sahsha posted at March 15, 2005 4:07 PM

It'll pass.

We (your readers) will still be here. :)

Comment from: John posted at March 15, 2005 4:29 PM

Sorry you're having a rough time of it Eric. But do think about this...

Perhaps this was exactly the kind of hornet's nest Alien Dice was hoping to avoid by running the newsbox in question..?

Comment from: John posted at March 15, 2005 4:30 PM

I meant "not running."

Comment from: Reave posted at March 15, 2005 4:32 PM

Oi! Leave Kurtz alone. True, the man can be the world's biggest dick, but after reading Bobby's comments, I'm surprised anyone can try and give relevance to them. Kurtz said his piece, and then Bobby completely made up an entirely new conversation in his head. I mean... christ, his response to most of the responses was "hey! I'm not *blank*! You're the *blank!*" Then he called Kurtz a liar. Something which he didn't even TRY to give credence to. We're just supposed to take this word for it, as it's happened HUNDREDS of times in the past.

Right...

Voltaire was the man. I'm a Republican, but I'm the kind of Republican that thinks that you should have the right to say whatever you damn well please, just as long as you can find a spot to stand in. So while I disagree with your entire comment on the situation, Eric, I do not believe you should be held in error for wanting to say them.

Comment from: Haver posted at March 15, 2005 4:37 PM

More of a Rousseau man myself.

Actually, I have no knowledge of the man, but I'm studying the French Revolution and both his and Voltaire's names popped up.

Which is nice.

Comment from: Xeres posted at March 15, 2005 4:51 PM

Voltaire wasn't just the man. He was THE MAN.

In my opinion, at least.

Comment from: kirabug posted at March 15, 2005 4:53 PM

http://www.itswalky.com/d/20020504.html

some days we're joyce, some days, we're the rain. it's okay - and human - to be both.

Comment from: Tangent posted at March 15, 2005 7:12 PM

Reave... maybe at the beginning, this was true. But Kurtz keeps returning to the thread over and over and over again, when we've gotten it to die down. Hell, we were talking about Harry Potter, for crying out loud. There was no need to take this thread and once again drag it through the muck... but Kurtz did. He's lost my respect.

Fortunately, if I need to read a snark or hear an opinion, Eric's here. Hey, his snarks are much more entertaining and informed. :)

Even if he needs to take a day off occasionally. ;)

Robert A. Howard

Comment from: Forsaken_One posted at March 15, 2005 8:18 PM

I hope the irony of Eric posting the snark in question directly after he posted a snark acknowledging his impact on the webcomics community isn't lost on anyone. Had it been before that I think he could have said the views were simply those of a random blogger and of little consequence in the grand scheme of things. But to post one of the low-points of Websnark (in my opinion) after pointing out how much traffic and influence he and his site have... well, the backlash certainly can't seem too unexpected when you take that into consideration.

Comment from: Eric Burns posted at March 15, 2005 8:37 PM

But to post one of the low-points of Websnark (in my opinion) after pointing out how much traffic and influence he and his site have... well, the backlash certainly can't seem too unexpected when you take that into consideration.

As they say, "it's a fair cop."

No arguments here.

Comment from: thok posted at March 15, 2005 9:16 PM

I'm sorely tempted to evoke Santayana. You mentioned not knowing why Sean Howard of AMD felt marginalized in the web-comic world, so I suggest googling "Squidi" together with "Penny Arcade" or "Kurtz" to find out why.

Keep up the good work, though-this will blow over soon enough.

Comment from: Shaenon posted at March 16, 2005 1:01 AM

When Scott Kurtz gets involved in these idiotic flamewars, does he ever *not* accuse the people he's arguing with of being jealous of him? Because it would be cool to see that.

Eric's original Snarks were reasonable, intelligent, and not at all out of line, especially after he had the grace to apologize when he got some of the details wrong. The abuse he's taken --and, amazingly, just keeps taking-- as a result makes me sick to my stomach. In particular, Kurtz and the Penny Arcade guy should be ashamed for abusing the influence they hold over their armies of brain-dead followers. They ought to know better. I know they don't, bute they *ought* to.

Anyway, the whole thing makes me wish that my comics had more hot guy-on-guy action.

P.S. Eric, you've apologized enough. Don't let these pencil-dicks keep picking at you. This is getting stupid.

Comment from: Forsaken_One posted at March 16, 2005 2:19 AM

Shaenon, I really don't think it's necessary to start name calling here. Naming all penny-arcade readers as "brain dead" or insulting those who are critical of Eric's post is simply uncalled for. It just brings down the level of conversation.

Comment from: Prodigal posted at March 16, 2005 3:24 AM

She wasn't insulting everybody who criticised Eric's posts. Just the ones that have been assholes about it.

Comment from: Alexander Danner posted at March 16, 2005 3:42 AM

You're a good man, Mr. Burns. With more personal integrity than any two average netizens combined.

I was planning to write a little essay taking you to task for your comments about infinite canvas, but I think I'll let that go for the time being. You've been picked on enough this week.

Comment from: Tangent posted at March 16, 2005 3:43 AM

Time to do a blanket generalization here. :D

Of course Kurtz is going to trashtalk Eric. Eric is competition in the rant-department. Egotistically speaking, Kurtz feels that only the best should survive. The best being himself. Since Eric made "a mistake" and admitted to it, this "proves him weak" and thus means he does not "deserve" to be around.

Survival of the fittest and all that.

The truth is... Eric's model of operation is much better. Websnark is the better model for "rants" because it allows for mistakes and admitting them. This lets people with half a brain or more (such as me) retain respect for Eric when he makes a mistake.

When Kurtz made a mistake in a recent rant against Keenspot, he erased the error without comment. No apology for getting it wrong. No admission of fault. Anyone who read the rant ahead of time and didn't return would not know of the mistake that Kurtz had in the rant.

Eric, on the other hand, snarked about something and then /learned he was wrong/ about it. As a result, he published a retraction... and is a better man (and snarker) for it.

Besides, his snarks are fun, and Wednesday draws great tea-based comics. :D

Robert A. Howard, who really should be in bed now

Comment from: Andy H. posted at March 16, 2005 4:09 AM

Anyway, the whole thing makes me wish that my comics had more hot guy-on-guy action.



My money's on Madblood.

Comment from: Brian posted at March 16, 2005 5:40 AM

The thing that troubles me the most about the Penny Arcade tirade is that we're just three months removed from the glowing mention of Websnark in conjunction with the Child's Play fundraiser. (That's http://penny-arcade.com/news.php3?date=2004-12-10 , just in case I fail once again to get the links to work.)

I know they're different guys doing the posts, but there's something about the shift away from "Hey, here's a guy using his skills to help our charity, and here's where to go for more information!" toward what we're getting now...well, it bothers me more than I can say.

And I come at this from the perspective of a guy who discovered Websnark before Penny Arcade (exact sequence: Comics Buyers Guide led me to PvP, which led me to Websnark, which led me to Penny Arcade), so consider this another vote of support.

Comment from: William_G posted at March 16, 2005 8:31 AM

Eric, I'm going to cash in on my status as your occasional Personal Jesus and deliver some harshness... None of it directed at you:

1) If PVP or Penny Arcade didn't debut back during the dotcom boom, they would be battling amongst each other to get into the top 200 at some toplist somewhere. They all know that, and eventually the webcomics readers will know it as well.

2) The more I read from Gabe, the more certain I am that the guy has sub-G.E.D. reading comprehension skills.

3) Shaenon is right about all three of them, and how they use their fans. It's what happens when when you give a small amunt of influence to some guys who spent most of their lives having their milk-money stolen from them.

4) After getting more familiar with Bobby Crosby's "thoughts" around the web, I have concluded that he's a waste of his daddy's sperm.

5) Remember the most important thing: You have just felt the "tall poppy syndrome" in effect. But what people seem to forget is that people who cut down the tallest poppy (you) are in essence admitting that you're much better than them. And you are.

Eric, they're all web trash, it doesnt matter how many hits they get during a day. Pay them no mind and get back to doing what you do best.

Comment from: William_G posted at March 16, 2005 8:36 AM

One more thing... Hotmail and Yahoo has some of the strictest abuse policies I've ever seen. Send the full headers of the nastier emails to the abuse admins and get them shut down.

Also, if anyone is using company email, forward the email to the admin of the company. They'll get called on the carpet by their boss.

I've done both before, they're very effective ways of dealing with web-trash.

Comment from: Syd posted at March 16, 2005 9:16 AM

One more thing... Hotmail and Yahoo has some of the strictest abuse policies I've ever seen. Send the full headers of the nastier emails to the abuse admins and get them shut down.

People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. Last I checked, most ISPs have strict rules regarding defamation. Calling Bobby Crosby a waste of sperm is pretty much it in the bag.

I like the example given here:

All wrong: "My neighbor John Smith is a stinking lush." This is wildly defamatory: an unproven, malicious ("stinking" and "lush" instead of "alcoholic") statement about a private individual.

Getting better: "Governor Smith consumed 14 glasses of whiskey last night at The Watering Hole Bar. In my opinion he's an alcoholic." The proof is a bit hazy getting drunk once does not prove alcoholism but a governor is a public figure with less protection than John Smith, you have clearly separated fact from opinion, and there is no particular evidence of malice.

Pretty safe: "Governor Smith consumed 14 glasses of whiskey last night at The Watering Hole Bar. I wouldn't be surprised to learn he's an alcoholic." This is entirely fact, with no clear evidence of malice, about a public figure.

You effectively stated your opinion as fact, I don't think Bobby Crosby really counts as a public figure (though even if he did, that doesn't rule out defamation by any means), and your comment could certainly be construed as having malice.

Do you feel I should report you to your ISP, perhaps leading to your account being cancelled, even you being blacklisted?

Or would you suggest that you have the right to state your opinion - however inflammatory it may be - and that a mild overstepping of boundaries is not grounds for reporting your behaviour as abuse?

To be perfectly clear, I have no intention of reporting you to anyone, regardless of your answer. I do think you might want to reconsider on what grounds you feel the kind of behaviour you advocated is acceptable though, and how you would feel if your own logic was turned against you.

Comment from: William_G posted at March 16, 2005 10:10 AM

Utter rubbish, Sid.

Assuming that Eric is getting abusive emails... emails that he did not instigate, it is within his rights as a service user to complain to the abuse admin. It's a pretty simple concept= Report abusive emails to the Abuse Admin. That's what he or she is there for.

Anywawy, if you want to report me to your local Road Runner branch for saying mean things about that, poor, innocent, always sensible, angel of the internet who would never stoop to hurling abuse himself, Bobby Crosby, you go right ahead. I'm certain they'll stop laughing at you eventually.

Comment from: William_G posted at March 16, 2005 10:12 AM

Sorry, "Syd"

Comment from: Stephen Kyle posted at March 16, 2005 11:04 AM

Urgh! You even bicker amongst yourselves, for no real reason!

Does everyone connected to the Internet have some chip in their head that causes them to argue about the most insignificant of things?!

Comment from: Reave posted at March 16, 2005 12:13 PM

Yes...

Why? Didn't you get yours? Mine came free with the installation CD for my DSL modem.

Comment from: Shadowydreamer posted at March 16, 2005 1:21 PM

As the person who started a three day debate about the proper length of toe nails that topped 290 posts.. I can't say for chip on the shoulder, but I can say to post in forums and blogs you have to have some appreciation of the minute and meaningless. :)

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